How hard is it to become a superstar these days? Two experts consider Glen Powell

The ladder to fame, Lindsey Weber and Bobby Finger declare, is broken. For a decade, the two have been picking apart the gradations of fame on their podcast, “Who? Weekly,” watching as the old monoculture fades into a blur of indistinct stardoms and not-really-stardoms.

“If A-listers are calling the paparazzi, and people whose names we’d never seen before can fill stadiums, it’s truly impossible to tell the difference between a B- or C-list celebrity anymore,” they write in their new book, “I Want to Be Famous: When Everybody and Nobody Is a Celebrity.”

Instead, Weber and Finger divide the famous into Whos and Thems. Whos are people presented as famous without being famous, really: lesser-known actors, reality TV stars, podcasters and influencers. They stand below and apart from Thems, the genuine household names like Beyoncé, Denzel Washington or Tom Hanks.

It’s still possible to reach the heights of fame, but it’s far from straightforward. To explain the dynamics involved in trying to rise to the big time, Weber and Finger considered the not-quite ascent of actor Glen Powell, whose quick rise and plateau shows just how easy it is to become a Who and how hard it is to become a Them.

Note: “Twisters” was distributed internationally by Warner Bros., which is part of Warner Bros. Discovery along with CNN. “Everybody Wants Some!!,” “Top Gun: Maverick” and “The Running Man” were produced by Paramount, which has an agreement to purchase Warner Bros. Discovery.

Additional production by CNN’s Eleanor Stubbs.

林赛·韦伯和鲍比·芬格宣称，通往名利的阶梯已经断裂。十年来，两人一直在他们的播客节目“谁？周刊”中剖析名利的层级，目睹着旧有的单一文化逐渐消逝，取而代之的是模糊不清的明星和名不见经传的“明星”。

“如果一线明星都在叫狗仔队，而我们以前从未见过的人也能让体育场座无虚席，那么真的不可能再区分二线明星和三线明星了，”他们在新书《我想出名：当每个人都是明星，而没有人是明星》中写道。

韦伯和芬格并没有将名人一概而论，而是将其分为“名人”和“他们”。“名人”指的是那些被包装成名人但实际上并不出名的人：例如名气不大的演员、真人秀明星、播客主播和网络红人。他们的地位低于“他们”，后者指的是像碧昂丝、丹泽尔·华盛顿或汤姆·汉克斯这样真正家喻户晓的人物。

虽然仍有可能登上名利的巅峰，但这绝非易事。为了阐释跻身一线明星行列的种种复杂因素，韦伯和芬格考察了演员格伦·鲍威尔的成名之路。鲍威尔的迅速崛起和昙花一现恰恰说明了成为“普通人”是多么容易，而成为“普通人”又是多么艰难。

注：《龙卷风》由华纳兄弟公司负责国际发行，该公司与 CNN 同属华纳兄弟探索频道。《人人都想来点儿！》、《壮志凌云：独行侠》和《奔跑者》由派拉蒙影业制作，该公司已达成收购华纳兄弟探索频道的协议。

CNN的埃莉诺·斯塔布斯也参与了制作。